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No Roth conversion for me this year

October 1st, 2025 at 04:15 pm

Now that the 3rd quarter is behind us, I thought it would be a good time to project my total 2025 income and see if I could manage a small Roth conversion while still staying in the 12% bracket, which tops out at $48,475. Cus I'm not sure my income would ever exceed the 22% bracket, which tops out at $103,350 for a single person, so not sure during a Roth conversion now and paying 22% taxes would offer any benefit.

To my surprise, my projected income this year, between annuity payouts, traditional IRA distributions and a few taxable mutual fund distributions, total about $63,000, and that's not including dividends or cap gains on two taxable brokerage funds. That was surprising since my expenses have remained in the low $40s for many, many years. But then I already forgot the January purchase of my new SUV, and the whole idea of taking out a loan for the purchase was to avoid a larger $30K bump-up in my income that would push me into the 22% bracket. I've been aggressively prepaying the loan in addition to the regular payments, and all told, all those car payments do seem to account for most of my income increase. (I plan to have it paid off next year.)

Although my income will be over $63,000 this year, with the standard deduction of $15,750, my adjusted income will be roughly $47,416, just within the 12% bracket. Cap gains and dividends will likely add another $3,000 or so to that total, but I guess I can live with that.

 

15 Responses to “No Roth conversion for me this year”

  1. GoodLiving Says:
    1759351728

    PS, you are very financially conservative and I aspire to be like you.

  2. LivingAlmostLarge Says:
    1759357767

    you can wait a little longer. Do you want a roth conversion? Do you get rmds?

  3. Tabs Says:
    1759364493

    Sounds like a lovely problem to have. Congrats!

  4. patientsaver Says:
    1759408342

    Thank you for the compliment, GoodLiving! I am honored.

    LAL, no, I don't get RMDs yet but it would be desirable, if I had room in the 12% bracket for small conversions between now and age 70, when I plan to collect SS, to draw down my trad IRA funds to make future RMDs lower. I like the idea of not being beholden to anyone for (possibly higher) future tax payments, but it's not essential.

    Tabs, it IS a nice "problem" to have, and I am eternally grateful to myself for having worked very hard for many years to have this problem. I think when you're single, you make greater efforts to ensure for your financial well-being since no one else is going to do that for you.

  5. Dido Says:
    1759408413

    And remember cap gains are NOT adding to your "ordinary income" bracket of 12%. Neither are your *QUALIFIED* dividends. Those are taxed at the capital gains rates.

    Also if any of your mutual fund distributions are coming from a regular BROKERAGE account rather than an IRA or qualified retirement plan account, the distributions are not taxed. For taxable brokerage accounts, you are taxed on the interest, dividends, and cap gains from sales, but not on actual distributions. That's why it is nice to have a good-sized taxable brokerage account in retirement and not just everything in retirement plan accounts.

  6. Dido Says:
    1759409017

    ALSO, your standard deduction for 2025 will be $17,750. There's an addition for being over 65, PLUS the new tax law increased what *would* have been a $17k standard deduction of $17k with the over-65 addition to $17,750. Not to mention, the act also added, for tax years 2025-2028, an "Enhanced Senior Deduction" of up to $6,000. Your AGI may be over 63k, but that's not the number to use to determine whether or not you can stay within the 12% bracket or not.

  7. PatientSaver Says:
    1759410837

    Thanks, Dido. That's a lot of tax deductions. A great reason to spread out Roth conversions for the next 4 years. With that added insight, it looks like I can do a small conversion of at least $7,000 and still stay in the 12% bracket.

    Does this mean it makes more sense now to itemize deductions if you have big deductions like property taxes since the new $6K deduction for seniors is available whether or not you itemize?

  8. Nobody you know Says:
    1759424043

    Wow, it looks like Republicans gave seniors a nice tax deduction in the One Big Beautiful Bill!

  9. PatientSaver Says:
    1759429015

    It is a nice tax deduction, Raven, but it doesn't make up for a thousand other acts he's taken that hurt everyday Americans. Trying to get rid of affordable healthcare for millions of self-employed people. Arresting people without cause, and without due process. Intimidating everyone from legal green cardholders to elected officials. Gutting the federal govt. Witholding funding for a clean energy/wind project in my state that was 80% complete. That's just petty. Luckily, it won't stop the project. Aside from all that and many things not even mentioned, he's a small, vindictive man more concerned with revenge against perceived enemies. He's repulsive. I'd happily give up this temporary tax cut to see the orange man go.

  10. Tabs Says:
    1759438740

    NYK: I've even blogged on here about it before, which is basically to say that, yes, while the BBB / Trump tax cuts do give the average American a pittance, all of that still does not justify the far, far bigger breaks and cuts for the top 1% of earners who at that point does not even need the additional tax breaks.

    And yet, my own personal calculations came out to be roughly $300 for those who earns roughly $50k per year, compared to their average addition of roughly $60k extra for the top 1%. Extra. That's on top of whatever tax breaks they already have or typically use to dodge EIC to begin with. And that's just on the Trump tax cuts alone, without even getting into anything else that was even more egregious contained within the BBB.

    It's like drinking a poison cocktail, but then say, "Hey, see how the Republicans added drops of mint and vanilla so for you? Doesn't it taste good?"

  11. LivingAlmostLarge Says:
    1759439496

    Patient you don't need an RMD until 73 I believe. I am bad at remembering people's birthdays. So you have extra time to eek out the conversions.

    Dido distributions from mutual funds are taxed if in a regular brokerage account. They are capital gain distributions on line 2 of the 1099 and they flow to schedule D below the line 13. Non-dividend distributions are also taxed. https://www.fidelity.com/learning-center/investment-products/mutual-funds/taxes

    PS you do get the $6k off the top to the standard deduction plus the 65 over $2k extra. So total is $17,750 + 6000 + 48475 = $72225.

    It's hard becaues a lot of distributions happen at the end of the year causing people a problem who are retired. What I mean by wait is I would wait to see how things are shaking out before converting

  12. Dido Says:
    1759451680

    LAL, I'm pretty sure PS was not using the term "distributions" in the sense of "capital gain distributions," but rather in the sense of funds she took from her account. I did tell her explicitly to check last year's line 13 of Schedule D in an off-blog email I sent to her.

    Part of becoming a financial professional is that you start to use words in the way that the profession uses them, which can depart from ordinary understanding.

    Many people use "RMD" as a short-hand for IRA distribution, even when they are not yet required to take distributions. PS's RMD age will indeed be 73.

  13. Dido Says:
    1759452137

    LAL, I agree, waiting until November when most of the cap gain distribution estimates are out is advisable for getting a better handle on those year-end distributions.

  14. Tabs Says:
    1759454723

    Sorry, I realized that I kind of low-balled the figures in my previous comment. Those making $50k each year would get LESS than $300 extra, while those earning $1 million or more would get about $90,000 extra.

    Also, perhaps my analogy of poison is a bit unfair. If so, let me stand corrected, as there is nothing poisonous about getting $300 extra on your tax returns. However, I hope the unnecessarily huge gap for the rich is quite evident.

    Source: https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/by-the-numbers-house-republican-tax-agenda-favors-the-wealthy-and-leaves

  15. Nobody you know Says:
    1759607330

    Not sure the rich are doing such a good job of avoiding income taxes. The following is from The Tax Foundation’s most recent statistics.

    “In all, the top 1 percent of taxpayers accounted for more income taxes paid than the bottom 90 percent combined. The top 1 percent of taxpayers paid $864 billion in income taxes while the bottom 90 percent paid $599 billion.”

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